Dear Resident,
Before I begin the Q&A, I want to say this is probably one of the most-lengthy and frustrating experiences I have had from my two years of being a Councillor. I am deeply shocked and also saddened by the lack of response and detail from the department and relevant officers that have implemented the Low Traffic Neighbourhood Scheme. I hope this thread helps you in your enquires. I will be making more enquiries and hopefully meet with officers soon.
Here you can submit your views on the scheme: https://letstalk.enfield.gov.uk/foxlaneQN/survey_tools/statutory-consultation1
Emails begin:
Dear Department,
I would like to vent my frustration at the plans and subsequent implementation of the Fox Lane Quieter Neighbourhoods scheme.
Last night I met with many residents (In a composed, safe outdoor environment with masks and socially distancing) on the Meadway triangle that joins both Meadway and Bourne Avenue.
The feelings of many residents towards the scheme was clear- they don’t want, they didn’t ask for it, and quite frankly many at least around the Meadway Estate want it taken out entirely.
I will go through each point separately:
- Extremely poor consultation
Residents feel that the consultation was pushed through too quickly. Many feel that the engagement event held on Tuesday 12th November should not have been the one and only consultation the council had with its residents. Yesterday residents were asking why the Leader and Deputy Leader of the council respectively, hadn’t met themselves with the residents to take their concerns on board. They were concerned that only one councillor-me- had tried to engage whereas the person who instigated this- Cllr Ian Barnes- was nowhere to be seen.
On top of that, we also have a lacking social media campaign which residents follow often and would have appreciated more information form the council on platforms such as Facebook and Nextdoor. Yesterday I did a show of hands, and residents vastly use these platforms, and mention how I comment more compared to any council account. That’s completely unacceptable and shameful that we have inconvenienced the lives of so many and didn’t even have the decency to advertise it properly. One resident was furious to receive a council letter with the face of the Leader and yet on this important issue complete silence.
Question (1) by Cllr. Ioannou: When does the consultation start and finish, and in light of COVID can we ask for an extension timeframe to gather more views?
Question (1) Response by Officer: The consultation is scheduled to start w/c 12th October – letters will be sent to homes in the area and we will update the project page. We will announce on social media too. This will last for six months.
Question (2) by Cllr. Ioannou: Can we expect more of an effort from the relevant department to advertise the scheme on social media?
Question (2) Response by Officer: As mentioned above
Question (3) by Cllr. Ioannou: Can we expect any officers or Leader/ Deputy of the council to have a meeting with residents?
Question (3) Response by Officer: Depending on Covid-19, pop-up events may be organised. Although obviously in the current climate we will not be encouraging groups to gather. Other online events can be considered.
Question (3) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou: I feel the leader and officers should swiftly organise one or even two meetings in three month intervals to take questions and feedback. Covid gives an opportunity online for this.
Question (4) by Cllr. Ioannou: Residents are asking for what is credible and not credible feedback from the departments perspective. What points would/ won’t be considered by the officers when the final decision is made, is there a criteria?
Question (4) Response by Officer: All views, both for the scheme and against it, will be considered and reported on in the final report.
Question (4) Rebut by Cllr Ioannou: Similar to planning applications, is there any guidelines on what will be legitimate and considerable feedback? In planning we have acceptable and non-legitimate reasons for appealing/supporting applications. Residents are sceptical of giving feedback and think the department should be more clear on what responses are even considerable. Is there any guidance?
Question (4) Rebut by Officer: The consultation provides the right for individuals to make any comment which they feel is appropriate. All views will be considered and the purpose of the report is to provide a rational response to the issues raised.
Question (5) by Cllr. Ioannou: One resident mentioned worryingly that the department will only take on board negative comments as positives will only constitute a continuation. Is this the case?
Question (5) Response by Officer: All comments both positive and negative are logged and recorded and will be included in the final report
- Statistics
Residents are concerned with how the council will go about evaluating the positives and negative implications of the scheme. Let me make it absolutely clear, I have never seen and have never received any tangible stats to give a decent background to how this scheme started with regards to air pollution, congestion, collisions etc. Under what grounds therefore are the officers and those executing the final decision going to decide if the scheme was beneficial or negative from a stats perspective?
Question (6) by Cllr. Ioannou: Does the Council have data for many months before the installation of these planters at sites like the Meadway. If yes please can I have the FULL REPORTS FOR ALL SITES IN THE SCHEME.
Question (6) Response by Officer: The baseline traffic data is referenced and linked to from the report approving this trial. Details on this data is here: https://letstalk.enfield.gov.uk/2734/widgets/9482/documents/5348
Question (6) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou: This document gives me serious concerns.
Question (6.A) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou: Why did the department decide that an emergency gate was necessary for Meadway 20 going through to 1 and 3 when clearly the department can see from the data that this is one of the worst effected?
Question (6.A) Rebut by Officer: In response to feedback from emergency services.
Question (6.B) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou: Why are the department promoting street closures to traffic entirely on other less affected roads and implementing a penalty and revenue generating scheme on the most supposedly congested road?
Question (6.B) Rebut by Officer: As above.
Question (6.C) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou: From points one and two I am 99% under the impression the department are trying to generate revenue from this unfortunate scheme, can I please get some understanding why there is a gate here and nowhere else
Question (6.C) Rebut by Officer: As above.
Question (6.D) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou: I am deeply concerned that only three different types of remedies have been issued. Why not street narrowing? Width restrictions? Humps even?
Question (6.D) Rebut by Officer: This has been trialled before and deemed not effective.
Question (6.E) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou: On Page 15 of the report there is a clear anomaly in the data. You have dispersed the data from: Meadway, Parkway, Bourne Avenue, Greenway and have given on Page 8 a data that shows where the cut-throughs lead/origin from on the Meadway. I feel the sum off all the roads mentioned- leading to the Meadway- are exaggerated. Under what formula was the figure therefore of 1400 for the 12hour survey given upon? I want to understand the calculation.
Question (6.E) Rebut by Officer: We have raised this question with the external specialist who presented the data.
Question (6.F) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou: I see there is a big change on the congestion levels from Pages 15-16, existing to proposed, which are increasing on Green Lanes, Alderman’s Hill, Bourne Hill, Cannon Hill and High Street. Can I add that Winchmore Hill Road be added to this immediately. Officers must recognise the increased congestion on this road also. Officers must also recognise that they have admitted congestion will be far greater on these main roads as a result of the scheme.
Question (6.F) Rebut by Officer: This issue is acknowledged at para 15 of the approvals report. We will collect data on Winchmore Hill Road as part of the monitoring.
Question (6.G) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou: Leading from point (6) can I please understand why the department are deliberately pushing traffic from these supposed cut-through roads and simply diverting and congesting more towards the main roads? This worsens journey times, increases pollution as vehicles remain stationary and isn’t good for anyone!
Question (6.G) Rebut by Officer: The rationale for the project is captured in the report however the principle is that smaller residential streets should not need to carry large volumes of traffic that is better suited to the primary road network.
Question (6.H) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou: Can I understand under what premise on Page 21 you arrived at these conclusions for estimates in post-scheme?
Question (6.H) Rebut by Officer: The estimates are based on a prediction of the traffic that was cutting through the residential streets being reassigned to the primary road network. The remaining traffic volumes within the area are the predictions, based on the origin and destination surveys of the number of trips by either residents or people visiting the area.
Question (6.I) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou: Can I understand please why the department have blatantly agreed more congestion will take place on main roads on Page 22? This makes absolutely no sense and doesn’t again help anyone.
Question (6.I) Rebut by Officer: As outlined at point 7.
Question (6.J) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou: I agree with the 20mph flat implementation.
Question (7) by Cllr. Ioannou: How does the council plan to monitor pollution levels prior and post the installation of planters. If there are quality monitors can they please be stated. If there is not this facility then how on earth will you monitor pollution level changes
Question (7) Rebut by Officer: The Borough has a number of air quality monitoring sites, models can also be created based on traffic data. http://www.londonair.org.uk/LondonAir/Default.aspx
Question (7) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou:
The borough has four air quality monitors?????
Where is there one near the LTN?????
The closest one is literally on the North Circular and we all know that is a mess.
Question (7) Rebut by Officer: Air quality modelling can take place based on the traffic volume data collected during the monitoring.
Question (8) by Cllr. Ioannou: Following from that question, can I also get an idea of how the council will monitor traffic count before and after, and not just on the roads where these planters are installed but also on the surrounding roads such as Morton Way, Cannon Hill, Bourne Hill, Aldermans Hill, Oakfield Road, Greenway, Caversham Avenue, St Georges Road, The Bourne. I would like EACH ROAD INDIVUDIALLY
Question (8) Rebut by Officer: Air quality modelling can take place based on the traffic volume data collected during the monitoring.
- Signage
Question (9) by Cllr. Ioannou: Many residents feel that the signage is better in some parts and poor in others. The Meadway had only had a dead-end sign installed with no signage like that compared to The Mall or Selbourne Road. Is there a more detailed plan that shows the placement of LTN signage? Maybe we can as councillors in the next consultation before approval or rejection give our views on where signs need improving or tweaking.
Question (9) Rebut by Officer: If you have specific feedback on signage then please provide it. Additional signs have been placed during the implementation of the works.
Question (9) Rebut by Cllr. Ioannou:
My issue is:
The enforcement camera by definition on the highway code states: Area in which cameras are used to enforce traffic regulations.
This definition is far too generic and can mean either ANPR, CCTV or your term of enforcement. https://www.highwaycodeuk.co.uk/information-signs.html
There isn’t even a sign which mentions the type of enforcement being enforced?? On approach it is only faiar a clear sign is placed stating no entry at all times If this isn’t implemented we are deliberately cash-cowing the scheme and will seem that we are footing residents with the bill.
Question (9) Rebut by Officer: Signs are in place to communicate that motor vehicles are not authorised to pass through. Further signs have been added to clarify this further. Additional camera signs are in place to warn drivers that camera enforcement is in operation. No entry signs cannot be used as it is not legally possible to provide an exemption to the emergency services if we use these signs – this closure is camera enforced to allow emergency services to pass through. The signs should be recognised by motorists and the Council will not receive any income if the lawful instruction that the signs provide is followed.
Question (10): Can you please confirm what the barrier and signage means on the Meadway so we can inform residents?
Question (9) Rebut by Officer: The Meadway sign indicates that motor vehicles are not authorized: https://www.highwaycodeuk.co.uk/road-signs-giving-orders.html. The camera sign is to provide warning that the order provided by the road sign is enforced by a camera and as such a penalty notice is possible if contravened.
From: Jill Billington
Date: 22 September 2020 at 10:29:22 BST
SENT TO THE MAYOR OF LONDON”S OFFICE:
I should be grateful if you can delegate answers to the following points
1. Your Quieter Neighbourhood project (in this case Fox Lane N13/14) has increased the pressures on the surrounding main roads such as Green Lanes (A105) and Bourne Hill plus Alderman’s Hill and Cannon Hill. This draconian control encourages idling engines thus increasing pollution, particularly at junctions like Southgate Roundabout where 5 roads join and Green Lanes which is now mostly single lane due to Cycle lanes on both sides.
2. Fox Lane, itself no longer accessible to Green Lanes, has now divided the Palmers Green N13 area so that local traffic is now cut off from local shops and community activities in Palmers Green. Consequently the residents on the north side of the dividing line now drive north to Winchmore Hill.
3. Ten long side streets have been converted into cul-de-sacs necessitating extra and longer drives for many residents.
4. In these long cul-de-sacs some lorries, delivery vans and other large vehicles need to reverse a long way back, between parked cars on both sides, onto a main road . Sensibly most do this slowly, causing more pollution. But twice I have seen a professional driver ‘lose their cool’ and reverse extremely fast, potentially endangering children and slow moving people. I would hope that locals who live here never suffer strokes or heart attacks.
5. Ultimately some such as Ocado, may refuse to deliver to any of these streets.
6. The new system seems to me to be an unintelligent way to manage traffic speed. The local authority, Enfield, must have spent a lot of money on flowers and composts for the barriers to attempt to reduce the impact but locals see this as a patronising irritant at a time when funding is desperately needed for housing, schools etc.
7. Like many people here I can’t cycle or walk any distance. The car is an essential asset, not the enemy.Safe, clean and effective use needs sensible management rather than manipulating people.
8. The restrictions may persuade some residents to use bikes or walk, but many of us will continue driving, reluctantly accepting the need for longer journeys and queueing.
9. I suggest that the problem of drivers crossing the area at speed could be easily managed with chicanes, as in The Netherlands, rather than full closure. Constraints like these can reduce traffic to 20 mph or even 10 mph but retain all access for residents.
As we have responsibly played our part for the last 6 months, and will have to again, is this the best time to control us even further? Really?
I look forward to your reply.
Jill Billington
Dear Jill
The points you have raised have been forwarded to the relevant officer and department for response
The following questions are still to be answered by our wonderful council:
1. By blocking my road you are punishing every resident on our road. Why should we be punished for living on Bourne Avenue? Why is the choice of which direction I want to follow be taken away from me by LB of Enfield? Why are those that live on Bourne not exempted from the traffic rules recently installed. Surely the residents of the road should not feel trapped inside their own homes?
2. The new road closures are funnelling all the road traffic through roads which could not take on the existing traffic. Roads such as Bourne Hill, The High Street, Cannon Hill, Aldermans Hill and Green Lanes in Palmers Green have become totally gridlocked during the mornings, the afternoons and in the evenings. The initial study into the current scheme grossly miscalculated how bad the traffic would be during these three periods of the day, every day throughout the week. This dramatic increase in congestion has a detrimental effect on the environment by increasing pollution as well as causing increased stress to the local residents.
3. Journey times have tripled due to the huge increase in traffic. Not only has this affected the school run for taking and collecting children but it has also increased the time to take necessary goods to vulnerable persons such as parents and grandparents. Both my wife and I regularly take goods to our parents who are both over 70 years old. During Covid this has become a necessity as those over 70 are the most vulnerable to the disease. Our parents live in Townsend Avenue and Cannon Hill respectively and the fact remains that it is impossible to carry these products by hand or by bicycle (which we do not even own).
4. The council has already wasted an estimated £300,000 on the previous failed scheme of the flower pots. I hate to think how many thousands have been spent on this current scheme. If we include the £42 million that was spent on installing the cycle lanes in Green Lanes (which are seldomly used) I am certain that taxpayers money can be better utilised. For example the collection of our recycling and rubbish should be once a week. Collecting this fortnightly has meant we have to use our cars more often to travel to the local dump and recycling bins. Council Tax has been increased by the maximum amount over the last two years, the Council should utilise these funds to improve the lives of its local residents. This latest traffic scheme does the exact opposite.
5. The installation of the camera scheme has caused huge confusion amongst drivers. I do not understand why they were not installed over a month after the other roads were closed. Initially more cars were driving down our road than ever before. Currently Bourne Avenue is become the rat run to cut out parts of stagnant traffic on Bourne Hill. Not only do we have concentrated pollution from Bourne Hill itself we also now have stationary polluting traffic queuing at the narrowest end of Bourne Avenue trying to cut back into Bourne Hill.
6. Why was Bourne Avenue chosen to have a camera system installed? Is this because we have a very popular café and take away restaurant at the end of our road. Did the Council deliberately choose this road to maximise revenues, punish these successful businesses as well as to punish local residents? Now that the camera has been installed, we are regularly seeing cars doing U-turns on our road, causing more traffic and more chaos.
7. Bourne Avenue has the most stringent planning rules because it is deemed a conservation area. One cannot even install skylights on their house without planning permission. Therefore why does the Council think it is a good idea to install an ever increasing number of ugly poles, traffic signs, warning signs and a huge new camera system? Can the Council please explain how these horrendous poles are in line with the keeping of the traditional view of our road?
8. Finally if the Council continues to assume that this scheme has been a success I would like to see the facts to support these arguments. I would be very grateful to see if these facts counter balance the points that I have raised above. The Council have alleged that they are ‘monitoring’ the traffic and the pollution of the new scheme. I, along with all the local residents would like to see the results of this monitoring. Can you please confirm when these results will be provided to us?
I know for a fact that many of the local residents have raised their concerns and complaints about this new scheme. Already 1,131 have signed a petition to stop the road closures. I would appreciate to find out when the Council will decide to have an open and honest review of this scheme especially as it is currently a trial.
I would also appreciate if you could explain how Richard Eason, an avid cyclist, cycle instructor, author of Cycle Enfield and who has a ‘side project’ called Cycle Fox does not have a conflict of interest when it comes to deciding on these road closures? Southgate and Enfield are not Holland and pursuing a strategy of creating a mini Holland without considering the effect on local businesses, local residents and the inevitable traffic chaos is a clear indication of the unfair prejudice that is being forced upon us by Enfield Council.
Dear Nicholas,
I have aknowledged fully the email. I appreciate these are questions that need to be anwsered by the department directly, so I have CC’d you in an emial with this message included.
It’s all a mess. The same has happened in Palmerston road, which broke up the traffic in green Lanes. All the ones that were helping ease traffic have been blocked, for no good to anyone. bikes still go on the pavement, even though they have bike lanes. This is all nonsense
Agree
York Warwick and Maidstone closures are simply
Moving rat runs and creating more pollution everywhere as traffic is gridlocked. Shops in palmers green and Muswell hill less business as it takes too long to get there. If Brownlow shuts in some vain attempt to turn it into Bounds Green Village this will cause people to move as getting anywhere will be lengthy create terrible pollution and more businesses will go under as traffic to
Them will be impossible. We personally would have a virtually impossible task returning home without doing illegal or lengthy u turns. Emergency access and caters for disabled plus curtailing deliveries of food and essential goods would double in time and we would become a no go area for deliveries. This is a major mistake long term and during the pandemic as more people rely on home help from deliveries to taxis to hospital appointments buses to hospitals and general living. It is already taking double time for every journey this will double. I will not take buses as they are packed with no social distancing and I am unable to ride a bike. I still work and need to drive as I need to earn a living despite being 66. I am healthy but with the added stress and fumes of pollution in the streets this may make me ill. My husband is asthmatic as is one of my sons. This has increased their asthma due to so much traffic hardly moving with traffic jams. Badly thought out scheme and for the vast majority an appalling unhealthy and bad for business scheme. Many boroughs are seeing sense and disbanding it and this must happen to ours and palmers green. If we want a village we can move out but we live in London because it is what we want and part of that is being able to enjoy our big diverse city warts and all. I have lived here all my life we have parks trees and many other beautiful places to go to. Brownlow Road being no cars is totally mad just like the whole scheme. Councillor Barnes tells us not to drive but he has two cars on his forecourt that he drives !
HI There,
I have lived on the High Street not far from meadway for 12 years. The impact that this scheme has had on our lives is significant and entirely negative. 1. The traffic congestion has meant moving around with a young child has become extremely difficult as we cant simply walk all of the time or use cycles as the scheme is designed. 2. When using our vehicle getting in and out of the entrance to our property is now very difficult as there is congested traffic most of the time so can take 10-15 minutes just to enter the high street. 3. I was not even notified or consulted regarding the scheme which is breathtaking when it is yards from our property, and in ignorance to the introduction of the scheme, and in september before signage was correctly and legitimately installed I was in receipt of a penalty. 3. Moving around southgate and the local area has become so difficult. Even using public transport such as buses is pointless as the routes are now blocked so you sit on a bus going nowhere.
4. To be honest the most significant is air quality. We live literally just off the high street and idling traffic congestion – which has increased drastically and simply cannot be disputed – has impacted my asthma to the point where i have had two major attacks since the scheme has started. The scheme is the only variable in this time. Im 41, dont smoke and exercise regularly. This scheme has impacted my physical and mental wellbeing to the point where as soon as our little one finishes at walker primary (we can walk to school) we are going to be forced to move away for our health.
Hi Graeme, Thank you for your message here. As you can see there are many questions that the department still havent responded and taken into consideration. This is a very poorly implemented scheme and in all my life of going through Southgate to get to work, I have never seen such a build up of traffic- all of which is man made- and entirely the responsibilty lies with the council who designed the awful scheme. I hope you included these comments on the portal so they can get your views and log them?
I must complain regarding the camera and signage to stop people going through the meadway, This is very badly signed there should be a large sign saying no vehicles allowed. I was fined by the council for driving through this area after not seeing the sign due to a supermarket delivery lorry being parked in front of the sign so I could not see it. Thankyou so much for making my Christmas
even more difficult financially and enjoy my money.
Just a thought, why were the cycle lanes run along side the main roads and not placed on side roads running parallel with the main roads, in conjunction with one way streets and parks, thus keeping cyclists away from busy main roads and allowing traffic to flow as before.
I drive a van due to my work but am an avid cyclist aswell.
Any idea what is happening on Morton way? The traffic is absolutely horrendous! continuous flow of Lorries and now Juggernauts are on the increase as well not to mention that when the weather gets bad Forestdale becomes an ice death trap. Surely Forestdale can be made one way going from Morton Way. A reduced access into Morton Way would stop these LARGE vehicles using Morton Way as a rat run for the North circular! Or even better have a no entry from Powys lane.
Hi Fausto, the roads you mention come under Southgate Green ward, they are out of my jurdistiction. I am Southgate ward only